Empowering Neurodiversity: Transformative Strategies for an Inclusive Workplace

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My favorite thing was the talks
from Colin. I think he got the

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information across really accessibly
but also in a way that I felt

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was sympathetic to people with ADHD.

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Loved hearing about the
different lived experiences

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from Tom and from Demet.
Both brought a completely

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different view point across
so really fascinating to hear

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I wholeheartedly recommend
it. 11 out of 10 or 100 out of 10.

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I think they give you really practical
takeaways and an opportunity to

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network with other people in
this field in a safe environment.

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This was really well thought
through. Brilliant speakers.

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People really need
to check this stuff out.

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Hello. Hello everybody. Wow,
everyone’s joining. So yeah, welcome.

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Great to have you all here
at Skills Sessions.

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So Skills Sessions online — just
going to let everybody join. Welcome.

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Say hello in the chat. So yeah,
welcome, everyone, to Skills Sessions.

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This is an event series that’s both online
and in person, hosted by CareScribe.

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It’s all designed to share knowledge
about areas of neurodiversity

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and disability and, ultimately, to
help build and foster an inclusive

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community for these sorts
of topics to be discussed.

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Each event is based
on a different topic

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and we’re excited to have
Theo Smith here today

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to kick off 2024. Very exciting.

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So yeah lovely to see
so many of you here.

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Please say hello in the chat.

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Let us know where
you are joining from.

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How cold is it where
you are? We’re in Bristol.

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It’s sunny, but pretty cold —
had to defrost the car again today.

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Most of you have already
twigged, but on the Zoom chat,

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make sure the
settings are set to “All”

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just so everyone can
see your messages.

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Otherwise, you’re just messaging
the hosts and the panelists

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And whilst we’d love to
hear from you, let’s share it

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amongst everyone if we can.

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And yeah. Please
keep posting.

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Post throughout the session.

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Keep the chat going. If
you’ve been to these sessions

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before, that’s always
one of the best bits is the

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chat and the community that we’re
sort of fostering here. So yeah.

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Brilliant. Ah, I can
see a couple of other

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folks from the southwest,
and even Bristol.

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So that’s fantastic. Sunny and
cold from all over, it looks like.

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Fantastic. Brilliant.

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So I mentioned this
is Skills Sessions

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and it’s hosted by CareScribe.
So I’m going to spend just five

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minutes just telling you a little
bit about who CareScribe is

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and what we do. And then we
will get on with the webinar and

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hand over to Theo who’s got
some fantastic wisdom to impart.

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So about CareScribe — who are
we? So my name’s Rich. I’m one of the

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founders and directors of CareScribe.
For those of you who haven’t

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heard of us, CareScribe is an
assistive technology company.

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And, as I mentioned,
we’re based in Bristol.

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Myself and my other two
founders, Chris and Tom,

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we’re all neurodivergent,
as are many of our team.

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And as a company, we spend every
day working to support disabled and

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neurodivergent individuals to
work and study more independently.

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And we do this by
building technology.

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We’ve got a couple of
software tools, which you may or

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may not have heard of. One
of them is called Caption.Ed,

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which is a captioning
and notetaking software

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that’s used to help people better
comprehend and retain some of the huge

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amounts of information that’s thrown
at us every day in our busy lives.

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Of course, that’s of tremendous
value to a wide range of people,

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those with disabilities, those
with neurodivergent profiles.

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You know, from those who are
maybe deaf or have hearing loss

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who maybe find it difficult to
comprehend what’s being said,

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to those like me who are dyslexic or
have ADHD or ASD, who may have

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similar difficulties
and difficulties

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with focus and
retention of information.

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Or even those who have, maybe,
a motor impairment and find it

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difficult to get their
thoughts down quickly.

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Captions there, as I say, to help
them to retain and comprehend

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some of the barrage of information
that comes at us every day.

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And then there’s
TalkType. So TalkType is

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our other software
which is a dictation

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software that helps
people convert their

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thoughts into text,
something that I

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and a wide range of people
find very challenging for a wide

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range of of reasons. I’m not
going to go into too much detail on

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our software. That’s not
the purpose of today. But if you do

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want to find out anything more
about CareScribe or our software

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and technology, then please get
in touch. You can pop something in

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the chat and we’ll pick it up. We got
some feedback at the end of the event

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and also through our
website at carescribe.io.

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We can set up a demo and get any
information over to you. Fantastic.

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So, finally, a little bit of
housekeeping. Keep the chat coming.

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Let us know where you’re tuning in
from. Lots and lots of people — wow — lots

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and lots of people joining.
Fantastic. What a good start to 2024.

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So yeah. A little bit of
housekeeping on Zoom: so, hopefully,

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you’re well-versed in Zoom
by now, but if anybody needs

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captions they are available through
Zoom. We’ve enabled them at our end,

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So please enable them at
your end if you require them.

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Questions and chat — very much
encouraged. If you do have questions

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about what we’re talking about,
there’s a Q&A function. Pop it in

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there if you can. And we will and
will take time at the end to answer

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those questions. You can also
upvote your question. So if you spot

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something in particular that someone’s
written and you want an answer to,

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do up vote it because if
we’re short of time, we’ll try and

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prioritise them over
based on demand.

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There’s no wrong
questions. This is a

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safe place to learn.
So, please, don’t hold

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on to your questions. Do ask
them. You’ll be glad to know

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this session is recorded. So
you’ll be getting a email from

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CareScribe after the event, and it’s
was also on LinkedIn tomorrow.

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So you will be able to access the
recording. So yeah. Keep your eyes

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peeled for that. The other thing,
finally, to mention is that we ran

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Skills Sessions throughout 2023
and they were really, really popular.

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We’re just kicking off 2024 now and
we’ve got lots planned for the year.

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So we’re running monthly webinars.
Obviously, this is January’s.

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We’ve got February’s
and March already

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out, so you can
sign up too. And lots of

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you already are signed up to
these. February’s topic is reframing

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neurodiversity for better mental
health. So if that sounds like it’s of

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interest to you, then please
sign up. We’ll be sure to send

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you details. March’s topic is
demystifying access to work,

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where, definitely, some demystifying
is needed. So yeah. Please tune

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into that if it is of interest.
Finally, end of the quarter,

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we are at the Dyslexia Show in
March. So if you’re going, we’re there.

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Come say “hi” — be nice to see you
in person. And if you’re not there,

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take a look at it because it looks
fantastic. Maybe you’ll want to join.

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Wonderful. So that’s
enough of me talking.

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I’m now going to hand over to Theo
— Theo Smith. So for those of you

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who don’t know Theo, Theo is
the founder of Neurodiversity World.

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He is a LinkedIn Top Voice. He’s
the author of the award-winning book,

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Neurodiversity At Work, and podcast
host of Neurodiversity With Theo Smith.

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So yeah — amazing speaker,
and we’re very, very lucky to

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have him here talking about
empowering neurodiversity.

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So without further ado, I’ll hand
over to to Theo. Keep the chat going.

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And yeah, I’ll
speak to at the end.

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Amazing. Thank you. Cheers.

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That’s incredible. I’m just
going to the awkward thing of

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sharing my screen
now. So great to be here

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with you all. I’m going
to try and inspire you,

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ignite some interest through some
storytelling. I’m 15 plus years in

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leadership roles in HR, recruitment,
working also within HR tech and

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a wide variety of organizations.
And I take some of that knowledge and

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expertise to support
organisations

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around neuroinclusion.
So let me —

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I can’t do two things at once,
clearly, because I was talking away and

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not sharing my screen. But here we
go. So that should have done it.

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So yes. I, in partnership with
Dynamis Group Talent Consultancy —

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yeah — there’s the
book and the podcast

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if you want to
find it later on and

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listen to some episodes or have
a little read. I co-authored the book

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with the incredible Professor
Amanda Kirby as well. And we’re now

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setting out to write our second
book. So keep eyes out for that.

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But it will probably
take 12 months to

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get out to you all. So
today’s topic. Here we go.

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Right, what is neurodiversity?
Probably, tonnes you here are like,

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“Right, I know what
neurodiversity is,” right?

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So I’m not going to teach you to

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suck eggs or whatever other term is
around teaching somebody something

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they already know, but neurodiversity,
for me, is the natural variation

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in our neurological makeup, right? Every
single one of us has a unique brain,

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billions of brain cells like a
thumbprint — not one of us has the same

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and just as be as
important to the ecosystem —

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so are diverse brains,
right? And we were

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meant to think differently.

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So that is what neurodiversity is.

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And it’s a powerful concept
for me because it takes

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a lot of the barriers down that,
unfortunately — and this is what we’re

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going to talk about —
sometimes labels can put up

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for individual scaling
and access to support.

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Right, but if we think
about neurodiversity

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as a concept, and
every single one of us

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having unique brain,
we’re talking about all

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of us — but, actually,
what we also need

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to consider is what those of us
who have been marginalised or

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system-impacted due to the
way that our brains work, right?

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And that’s the problem that we have,
that some individuals have faced

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barriers and, even
worse, they didn’t even

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know about it. So
historically, we all

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know that these neurodivergent
traits or neuro minorities or

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whatever the other terminology
you would like to use to describe

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people have been
locked out of the system

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because of the way
that their brain works —

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We’re talking about ADHD,
dyslexia, ASD, Tourette’s

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dyspraxia,
synesthesia, dyscalculia,

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Down syndrome,
epilepsy — I could go on.

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There’s also also other associated
challenges around chronic mental health

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illnesses, bipolar,
obsessive-compulsive, etc, etc, etc.

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For all of you
that know it, right,

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I won’t go on. But for
anybody who doesn’t,

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this is kind of the medical
terminology, I would say. We’ve got a

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problem with disorder too
much use of disorder. A lot of us

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are starting to see it through the
social model, not so much through

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the disability lens. Although that’s
not to take value away from that

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point of conversation, because much of
us need it to access help and support.

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It’s more to say that we are,
as a community, starting to

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reframe the way that
we see ourselves and

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the way that we would
like to see others.

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So yes. So let me
take a different journey.

00:12:27.720 –> 00:12:32.392
And if you’ve ever seen me speak
before I would — oh, yeah, so somebody is

00:12:32.400 –> 00:12:36.495
saying they prefer
using the term autistic

00:12:36.520 –> 00:12:38.600
referred to Autism
Spectrum Disorder.

00:12:38.625 –> 00:12:42.178
Just jump back — that is exactly
my point there. These are the

00:12:42.200 –> 00:12:46.560
medical terms that we didn’t get
to choose and that’s why we have a

00:12:46.600 –> 00:12:53.135
very stern-looking expert there
because these terms that were medical

00:12:53.160 –> 00:12:58.221
terms are not necessarily ones that
a lot of us have identified with.

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But we’re going to come on
two more about that in a second.

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This is the way that I
want to see it, though.

00:13:02.400 –> 00:13:04.095
This is the way I
like to see the world.

00:13:04.120 –> 00:13:08.148
The Earth itself is 4.5 billion
years in development, right?

00:13:08.172 –> 00:13:12.200
That’s important, right? 4.5
billion years this planet has

00:13:12.200 –> 00:13:15.888
been developing. We know that
the universe is expanding at a faster

00:13:15.920 –> 00:13:20.800
rate than we ever could have imagined.
So when we put our lives today

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into context of that period of
time, oh, it’s a pin-prick right?

00:13:26.240 –> 00:13:31.120
It’s almost inconsequential in
terms of the length of time that this

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planet that we live on, that we’re
borrowing time off, right, has been

00:13:36.812 –> 00:13:42.500
developing for 4.5 billion years.
Now, consider this, the Mexican tetra

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blind fish — one of the most researched
fish and animals on the planet —

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two million years ago evolved
or developed to be blind it.

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It lost its eyesight initially and,
eventually, it lost its eyes completely.

00:14:00.680 –> 00:14:03.880
And the reason being it took up a lot
of energy when you’re in the darkened

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caves of Mexico. And therefore,
you didn’t need this energy in these

00:14:09.520 –> 00:14:13.287
darkened caves to be wasted on
something that you couldn’t use.

00:14:13.312 –> 00:14:17.633
So they evolved to be blind. They
also evolved translucent skin,

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all of this to optimize to the
environment for survival, right —

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which is incredible two million
years ago. But actually, what we find

00:14:25.436 –> 00:14:30.575
is the Mexican tetra blind cave
fish that are now researched actually

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evolved to be blind only around
20,000 years ago. So not only are we

00:14:34.762 –> 00:14:38.899
seeing incredible adaptation to
an environment through what we

00:14:38.899 –> 00:14:43.420
would consider potentially traumatic,
from our own perspective, to lose

00:14:43.444 –> 00:14:47.899
eyesight and eyes, but actually
it’s happened. It’s cyclical.

00:14:47.899 –> 00:14:51.825
It’s been happening again and again.
The fish is predispositioned to

00:14:51.850 –> 00:14:54.100
make these
adaptations and changes.

00:14:54.125 –> 00:14:58.100
And that is incredible —
that a blind fish can

00:14:58.100 –> 00:15:01.953
be more competitive in that
environment than a fish with eyes

00:15:01.960 –> 00:15:07.520
because of the nature of the environment.
And how little do we give that in

00:15:07.500 –> 00:15:09.896
consideration to the
human brain and the

00:15:09.920 –> 00:15:12.760
way that the human
brain has evolved?

00:15:12.800 –> 00:15:16.880
So now, consider this, if
we consider neurodiversity by

00:15:16.899 –> 00:15:20.776
design, right, the neurological
variations by design,

00:15:20.801 –> 00:15:26.495
what we’re talking about is the human
brain has developed over 200,000 years —

00:15:26.520 –> 00:15:29.284
the modern human brain,
the big one in our heads, right?

00:15:29.308 –> 00:15:32.880
Before then, it was smaller. It’s
actually getting smaller again now.

00:15:33.500 –> 00:15:38.064
Technology — who knows where we’re going?
But 200,000 years ago it became big.

00:15:38.089 –> 00:15:40.228
And the reality is,
over that period of

00:15:40.240 –> 00:15:43.560
time, it’s optimised
to the environment.

00:15:43.680 –> 00:15:46.465
But we have a problem. If we
think around what happened to the

00:15:46.480 –> 00:15:50.024
Mexican tetra blind cave fish,
and we think about 4.5 billion

00:15:50.040 –> 00:15:53.787
years of development of the planet,
we think about 200,000 years of

00:15:53.800 –> 00:15:58.400
development of human brain — now,
what have we done, I guess, since the

00:15:58.399 –> 00:16:02.215
industrial revolution, right?
What have we done since we

00:16:02.240 –> 00:16:06.480
completely transformed the world,
possibly in less than 200,000 years?

00:16:06.760 –> 00:16:13.095
When we put people down mines, when
we put people in mills to produce

00:16:13.120 –> 00:16:17.400
cotton, when we did these things,
we were not thinking about the

00:16:17.399 –> 00:16:20.738
impact on the health and well-being
of those individuals. We were not

00:16:20.762 –> 00:16:24.100
thinking that they would die of of
horrible illnesses and they would

00:16:24.100 –> 00:16:29.426
suffer greatly. We were thinking
about building stuff, right?

00:16:29.595 –> 00:16:35.600
And the world that we’ve now built,
we built at such a rate of speed that

00:16:35.600 –> 00:16:41.984
we cannot expect the human
brain to evolve quick enough.

00:16:42.120 –> 00:16:44.591
It’s not possible when
we consider bright lights,

00:16:44.600 –> 00:16:46.895
noisy environments, planes,

00:16:46.920 –> 00:16:51.295
all these infrastructure that we’ve
built — AI machine learning and

00:16:51.320 –> 00:16:54.730
being put in chicken coops, then
being told to work from home.

00:16:54.760 –> 00:16:59.376
All of these adaptations and changes
are at such a rapid rate, and we’ve

00:16:59.400 –> 00:17:05.200
not thought about the impact on the
human brain, like we didn’t through

00:17:05.680 –> 00:17:11.280
the Industrial Revolution, and now,
globalisation — the internet of things, right?

00:17:11.307 –> 00:17:14.299
So we need to think about
adapting the environment

00:17:14.299 –> 00:17:19.091
because there is no way we can
expect the brain to adapt at pace.

00:17:19.120 –> 00:17:25.200
And by the way, the brain has been
evolving for 200,000 years, to be able

00:17:25.200 –> 00:17:28.514
to adapt to the planet
of 4.5 billion years.

00:17:28.520 –> 00:17:30.448
You can now see the
complexity, right?

00:17:30.472 –> 00:17:32.400
This is why we have to
take responsibility and

00:17:32.400 –> 00:17:37.788
accountability and open our
eyes and mind to the reality that the

00:17:37.812 –> 00:17:41.295
world we’re building
at a rapid rate is

00:17:41.320 –> 00:17:44.320
having a negative impact
on the human brain.

00:17:44.359 –> 00:17:49.175
So the reality is,
this topic is exploding.

00:17:49.200 –> 00:17:51.255
You go on Google
Trends, you can see

00:17:51.280 –> 00:17:53.215
people across the globe
are typing in neurodiversity,

00:17:53.240 –> 00:17:55.532
autism, neurodiversity
movement, at a

00:17:55.557 –> 00:17:58.575
rapid rate. People
want to know, right?

00:17:58.600 –> 00:18:04.175
TikTok, 12 months ago, 22.1
billion views of the #ADHD.

00:18:04.200 –> 00:18:08.335
Twelve months before that, I took the
same data. It was half that figure.

00:18:08.480 –> 00:18:11.735
I imagine, you know,
beginning of this year,

00:18:11.760 –> 00:18:15.575
it could be 40 billion, right? The
reality is more and more people

00:18:15.600 –> 00:18:19.793
want to know. It’s young people; it’s
old people; it’s people across the board

00:18:19.840 –> 00:18:22.948
are now going, “Wait a minute.
I’m facing barriers because of the

00:18:22.972 –> 00:18:25.929
way my brain works and I want to
remove those barriers, right? And

00:18:25.960 –> 00:18:32.095
And I want to influence organisations.
I want to influence environments,

00:18:32.120 –> 00:18:35.080
teaching environments. I want to
support my children to be able to

00:18:35.099 –> 00:18:36.997
remove some of these
barriers. And that’s

00:18:37.021 –> 00:18:38.823
why they’re going
any way they can go

00:18:38.840 –> 00:18:42.880
to be able to find information
to help empower them to be able

00:18:42.900 –> 00:18:47.788
to make these changes within their
environments, working environments,

00:18:47.812 –> 00:18:52.330
and for their family members.
But we have this challenge.

00:18:52.700 –> 00:18:58.255
The challenge is that we have these
labels and the labels, unfortunately,

00:18:58.280 –> 00:19:04.080
are not easy to access. And in some
areas of the world, they may not even

00:19:04.099 –> 00:19:08.935
exist as labels or they may have
negative connotations. And therefore,

00:19:08.960 –> 00:19:12.789
you may not want to be able to
connect with those labels at all.

00:19:12.814 –> 00:19:17.715
And we segment those labels in such
a way that they can be very confusing

00:19:17.739 –> 00:19:22.299
and complex, whereas we don’t
just have motivation; we don’t just

00:19:22.299 –> 00:19:25.655
have energy; you don’t just have
logic. We don’t just have creativity.

00:19:25.680 –> 00:19:28.720
Some of us may have more
logic, more creativity, more

00:19:28.700 –> 00:19:32.511
motivation, more energy levels at
any one point than someone else.

00:19:32.520 –> 00:19:36.235
But we all have them at some
point, right? And they cross over.

00:19:36.240 –> 00:19:40.648
There’s co-occurrence across these.
Well, the reality is, we now know

00:19:40.672 –> 00:19:45.175
that there’s co-occurrence across
these labels that we have that are

00:19:45.200 –> 00:19:54.295
attached to neurodiversity.
So consider this, we have these labels

00:19:54.320 –> 00:20:00.000
and they empower individuals to
be able to gain access to help and

00:20:00.000 –> 00:20:04.638
support, specifically within the
school system, education system.

00:20:04.663 –> 00:20:07.799
So there are parents who are stressed
out and anxious and banging their

00:20:07.799 –> 00:20:12.409
heads against a wall — they need the
label because the label, at the moment,

00:20:12.440 –> 00:20:16.720
is the only way that we, as
parents, can gain help and support

00:20:16.700 –> 00:20:23.738
for our child within that environment.
So the ADHD label comes with

00:20:23.762 –> 00:20:30.799
support if we can get the label.
Autistic label, autism label comes

00:20:30.799 –> 00:20:36.615
with support. But when in reality like
me or my daughter, we are autistic,

00:20:36.640 –> 00:20:40.080
ADHD, dyslexic — and who
knows what else — we could collect

00:20:40.099 –> 00:20:45.295
these labels up — that becomes
problematic because when you’re going

00:20:45.320 –> 00:20:49.920
for one label, you may be able to
get it, but then, you may not get the

00:20:49.900 –> 00:20:53.588
other label. However, the
reality is there’s co-occurrence there.

00:20:53.612 –> 00:20:56.862
You’re impacted by both. You’re
just not able to demonstrate.

00:20:56.880 –> 00:21:00.052
And that may well be because of
your early years’ experience because

00:21:00.077 –> 00:21:07.340
the diagnostic assessment model is built
around those early years experiences.

00:21:07.400 –> 00:21:09.944
Well, what if you were able to
get the support in those early

00:21:09.960 –> 00:21:13.080
years that meant you coped,
you managed to get through the

00:21:13.099 –> 00:21:18.255
education system for whatever reason,
but actually, now you hit perimenopause.

00:21:18.280 –> 00:21:21.200
And actually, the
system that you exist in at

00:21:21.200 –> 00:21:24.979
that point, as a senior leader
for example, and the barriers that

00:21:25.004 –> 00:21:31.799
you start to face and the changes
in your makeup, become so challenging

00:21:32.099 –> 00:21:35.187
that you can no longer function
in the way you did before.

00:21:35.213 –> 00:21:37.255
But you don’t have the label,

00:21:37.280 –> 00:21:39.900
and you don’t necessarily
have the evidence from

00:21:40.200 –> 00:21:44.135
being a young person and being
a woman and the way that the

00:21:44.160 –> 00:21:47.732
diagnostic models worked,
the barrier is significant.

00:21:47.760 –> 00:21:51.352
Well, this is when labels start to
become a problem, not just in terms of

00:21:51.360 –> 00:21:53.628
accessing support
and help but actually,

00:21:53.652 –> 00:21:55.920
in terms of being
able to identify as

00:21:55.900 –> 00:21:59.643
having a label to fully understand
your neurological makeup,

00:21:59.667 –> 00:22:03.799
therefore, to be able to let somebody
know within the organisation,

00:22:03.900 –> 00:22:07.756
“Hey, I need help, and I need help
because of this.” It can become very

00:22:07.800 –> 00:22:12.880
confusing and therefore, the barrier
exists because you can’t get the

00:22:12.900 –> 00:22:20.335
help and support — and that you’ve
not had it at any point in your life.

00:22:20.360 –> 00:22:23.600
And the reality is is for a
lot of individuals, they may

00:22:23.599 –> 00:22:27.488
have not got the label but they
may be sitting with the trauma.

00:22:27.519 –> 00:22:30.015
So if you imagine,
for me, when I was

00:22:30.040 –> 00:22:32.455
in the classroom, and I
couldn’t say my name properly,

00:22:32.480 –> 00:22:36.495
I used to say “Theo” and
everybody else could say “Theo” —

00:22:36.520 –> 00:22:39.200
it becomes very traumatic when
everybody else can say your name and

00:22:39.200 –> 00:22:43.403
you can’t say your name. So whether
that’s the dyslexia or the autism

00:22:43.428 –> 00:22:49.455
or the ADHD, whether the speech problems
were associated with any one of those,

00:22:49.505 –> 00:22:53.362
in the big scheme of things, at that
point, it doesn’t really matter to me.

00:22:53.493 –> 00:22:57.034
What matters is everybody else
can say my name, and I can’t.

00:22:57.321 –> 00:23:00.999
Everybody else can spell and
write on the board, and I can’t.

00:23:01.023 –> 00:23:04.700
And that trauma that we experience as
a young person, whether you have

00:23:04.700 –> 00:23:09.288
a label or not, we carry through
into the workplace. And especially if

00:23:09.312 –> 00:23:13.900
nobody’s been able to communicate
to us what that means, what it looks

00:23:13.900 –> 00:23:18.392
like, why it’s happening, the impact
of it, where the support exists,

00:23:18.416 –> 00:23:22.700
even as an older person
with experience and expertise

00:23:22.700 –> 00:23:26.219
and somebody who’s been able to survive
up until this point, when I still

00:23:26.240 –> 00:23:31.000
walk into a board room, I still get
heightened level of stress and anxiety

00:23:31.299 –> 00:23:35.495
because I’m asked to go and write
on a board for this group of senior

00:23:35.520 –> 00:23:38.880
leaders, who I’m used to talking to.
But the minute I’m asked to write

00:23:38.900 –> 00:23:44.095
on a board, I still can’t spell;
I still can’t write properly; I still

00:23:44.120 –> 00:23:47.200
can’t construct grammar. Yes, I
wrote a book, but with the help of

00:23:47.200 –> 00:23:51.688
technology, and nobody was stood
there watching me whilst I did it.

00:23:51.712 –> 00:23:56.200
And fundamentally, this is really
what’s important: when we insist upon

00:23:56.200 –> 00:24:00.655
labels and when we insist that
people need to come with a diagnosis

00:24:00.680 –> 00:24:04.200
or that they need to come with
an expectation of what help and

00:24:04.200 –> 00:24:08.335
support they need, we already
a raising the bar far too high for

00:24:08.360 –> 00:24:12.200
many people. And when we also add
in the complexity of some of these

00:24:12.200 –> 00:24:15.788
labels, for somebody who’s
dyslexic who struggles with words and

00:24:15.812 –> 00:24:19.400
grammar and understanding words,
you’ve already locked me out of the

00:24:19.400 –> 00:24:23.255
conversation and the decision.
How many people do we do that to?

00:24:23.280 –> 00:24:27.961
And by the way, it doesn’t just
exist within entry-level roles.

00:24:28.000 –> 00:24:32.488
For example, this is happening to
senior leaders who maybe have coped

00:24:32.512 –> 00:24:37.775
for so long or this might be happening
to people within the legal system.

00:24:37.800 –> 00:24:41.871
This might be happening to
a judge, right? If we don’t have

00:24:41.880 –> 00:24:47.375
people who are ADHD within the
legal system, then we’re going to

00:24:47.400 –> 00:24:51.037
continue to have a disproportionate
amount of people with ADHD or who

00:24:51.080 –> 00:24:55.920
had ADHD going into prison — 1
in 3 in Wales, for example, from

00:24:55.900 –> 00:25:00.088
Professor Amanda Kirby’s research.
So these are the things that we

00:25:00.112 –> 00:25:03.745
need to consider all levels
throughout the organisation.

00:25:03.760 –> 00:25:08.118
We have barriers that we can remove,
and we’re not going to remove them

00:25:08.142 –> 00:25:11.375
by just having labels.
And the reality is, if we

00:25:11.400 –> 00:25:13.920
talk about labels, we need
to talk about disclosure.

00:25:14.040 –> 00:25:18.248
So even if we are privileged
enough, even if we fully

00:25:18.272 –> 00:25:22.058
understand our neurological
makeup — like, who really does? —

00:25:22.080 –> 00:25:27.328
the reality is will we then
want to share that information?

00:25:27.352 –> 00:25:29.258
And this is a problem
that you have within

00:25:29.280 –> 00:25:32.600
the organisation is
you want people to

00:25:32.599 –> 00:25:37.087
tell you about some of their
challenges, their strengths, their

00:25:37.111 –> 00:25:42.200
abilities, yet there’s fear and
anxiety because people have experienced

00:25:42.200 –> 00:25:46.166
trauma, stigma, barriers, even in
environments where they thought that they

00:25:46.190 –> 00:25:50.099
were safe and later found out that
they weren’t. And we can see this

00:25:50.099 –> 00:25:55.295
is independent research by Auticon
in 2021. And think about what’s

00:25:55.320 –> 00:25:58.720
happened since then — it’s not
got any better. But you can already

00:25:58.700 –> 00:26:02.802
see the — I mean 2 in 5 are
not ready to tell people.

00:26:02.827 –> 00:26:08.024
So irrelevant if you want them
to tell you, they’re not ready.

00:26:08.049 –> 00:26:14.015
And if we think about the impact from
a cultural perspective, there are

00:26:14.040 –> 00:26:17.520
some individuals who can’t have this
conversation at home. They can’t talk

00:26:17.500 –> 00:26:21.187
about this in their community. How
can you expect them to come into

00:26:21.212 –> 00:26:27.400
the workplace and talk about
being dyslexic or autistic or ADHD or

00:26:27.500 –> 00:26:31.438
combination of, when it’s not even
accepted to be able to have this

00:26:31.462 –> 00:26:34.521
conversation within their home
environment, within their culture?

00:26:34.560 –> 00:26:38.967
This is an immediate barrier to
individuals being able to gain access

00:26:38.992 –> 00:26:43.557
to support and help.

00:26:43.600 –> 00:26:46.880
So what can we do
about it? What tools

00:26:46.900 –> 00:26:51.031
are available? How can we consider
making some of these changes and

00:26:51.040 –> 00:26:54.658
adaptations if we can’t
get people to tell us, right?

00:26:54.680 –> 00:26:58.512
Because every single one of us has a
unique environment, a unique workplace.

00:26:58.537 –> 00:27:03.920
We have unique challenges. We have
unique pressures. By the way, we have

00:27:03.900 –> 00:27:07.448
unique individuals who put up significant
barriers to us making changes.

00:27:07.480 –> 00:27:11.475
That’s the reality. And we also
live in a world where we’ve got to

00:27:11.500 –> 00:27:15.143
have control of everything, even
as HR leaders or Business Leaders

00:27:15.160 –> 00:27:20.000
or even working within your area.
We have to collaborate with so many

00:27:20.000 –> 00:27:24.688
other people, and not everyone will
buy into the concept and therefore,

00:27:24.712 –> 00:27:28.253
that can become quite challenging
to get things over the line.

00:27:28.330 –> 00:27:32.993
And a great point there — and the
barrier of getting a diagnosis in the

00:27:33.000 –> 00:27:38.200
first place. So my child, it took
us five years on waiting lists and of

00:27:38.200 –> 00:27:42.126
filling out forms to get the
ADHD and autism diagnosis.

00:27:42.160 –> 00:27:44.471
And by the way, there
were two separate

00:27:44.495 –> 00:27:47.295
lists, waiting lists.
And when we did get it,

00:27:47.320 –> 00:27:50.560
we then had to go through the process
of the EHCP because we realised

00:27:50.584 –> 00:27:57.500
actually, in the education setting,
the autism and ADHD diagnosis is

00:27:57.500 –> 00:28:02.455
like stilts with a match ready to
burn the studs beneath them

00:28:02.480 –> 00:28:04.735
because you can gain
support, and unless

00:28:04.760 –> 00:28:06.000
those individuals
who are giving you

00:28:06.000 –> 00:28:07.935
support decide they don’t
want to give it anymore,

00:28:07.960 –> 00:28:10.520
and you have not a
leg to stand on legally.

00:28:10.560 –> 00:28:13.000
So therefore, in
the UK, we had to

00:28:13.000 –> 00:28:16.938
progress to get the EHCP, which is
almost impossible to get in certain

00:28:16.960 –> 00:28:20.880
areas now, and the funding is changed.
Therefore the government now wants

00:28:20.900 –> 00:28:24.895
to discourage giving out EHCPs
because they want to change the

00:28:24.920 –> 00:28:28.280
mechanism of the way individuals
get support and they want to push it

00:28:28.299 –> 00:28:33.575
back into the education system,
which is very problematic. So, yeah.

00:28:33.600 –> 00:28:38.000
I fully understand the complexity
around getting a diagnosis unless

00:28:38.000 –> 00:28:41.262
you’re willing to go private
and the costs are significant,

00:28:41.280 –> 00:28:47.280
and the trust has gone from some of
these organisations because of the

00:28:47.299 –> 00:28:50.960
negative press in some of these
areas which has not helped.

00:28:52.320 –> 00:28:56.815
So what we need to do to remove
some of these barriers is we need to

00:28:56.840 –> 00:29:01.080
consider where kryptonite exists
within our systems, our processes,

00:29:01.600 –> 00:29:05.381
our communications. And I describe it
as kryptonite because whether you

00:29:05.400 –> 00:29:09.192
talk about Superman or whether you
talk about Clark Kent, if kryptonite

00:29:09.217 –> 00:29:14.895
is introduced into either of
their worlds, they become

00:29:14.920 –> 00:29:18.819
completely disabled. They’re
not able to carry out any task —

00:29:18.843 –> 00:29:23.855
irrelevant of whether it’s a
significant power skill, whatever —

00:29:23.880 –> 00:29:26.891
they’re completely disabled
to be able to do anything.

00:29:26.920 –> 00:29:32.080
And the problem we have there is
that often the kryptonite within our

00:29:32.099 –> 00:29:37.888
working environment is not visible.
Right? And the greater challenge

00:29:37.912 –> 00:29:43.700
is that because as individuals,
especially if I consider individuals

00:29:43.700 –> 00:29:49.335
with later diagnosis or individuals
who self diagnosis based on

00:29:49.360 –> 00:29:53.080
information that they’ve had —
not to gain anything, because of an

00:29:53.099 –> 00:29:56.888
insight to be able to help themselves
— we have spoon-fed ourselves

00:29:56.912 –> 00:30:00.700
to kryptonite for so long we’ve
become used to it. That doesn’t mean

00:30:00.700 –> 00:30:05.338
we’re able to perform effectively
in it. It just means we’re so used

00:30:05.362 –> 00:30:10.495
to spoon-feeding ourselves this
kryptonite, that it’s become a way of life.

00:30:10.520 –> 00:30:14.615
And you can define it as masking,
but it’s not just about masking.

00:30:14.640 –> 00:30:17.680
It’s the idea that you do
something to again and again and

00:30:17.700 –> 00:30:22.538
again, that is debilitating; that
is harmful; that hurts you.

00:30:22.562 –> 00:30:26.776
It’s like eating peanuts when
you have an allergy, right?

00:30:26.800 –> 00:30:28.588
You have just enough
allergy that you can

00:30:28.612 –> 00:30:30.855
survive every time,
but you keep doing it

00:30:30.880 –> 00:30:32.870
because people tell you,
“Eat the peanuts. It’s fine.”

00:30:32.880 –> 00:30:36.584
Everybody eats them. We all have to eat
our share of peanuts every single day

00:30:36.600 –> 00:30:41.323
to ensure that we complete our
work. And it’s become so harmful that

00:30:41.360 –> 00:30:44.569
it’s significantly impacted our
mental health and wellbeing.

00:30:44.594 –> 00:30:50.200
And that is why the topic’s becoming big.
We need, as a community, but also with

00:30:50.200 –> 00:30:54.338
the support of those in key positions
— yes, those leaders within HR,

00:30:54.362 –> 00:30:58.768
within people functions, but also
leaders of people, operationally,

00:30:58.799 –> 00:31:02.979
we need you to also do something
about this, to understand what the

00:31:03.000 –> 00:31:07.628
kryptonite looks like, and to
support us in either bridging it,

00:31:07.640 –> 00:31:12.042
so that some of us can circumvent it
or, in actual fact, eliminating it,

00:31:12.067 –> 00:31:15.052
taking it away where it
does not need to be there.

00:31:15.077 –> 00:31:18.480
So one way that we’ve been

00:31:18.500 –> 00:31:22.027
able to do this, and a way that I
advise organisations to do it, is

00:31:22.040 –> 00:31:25.800
if you are thinking of a
consumer process, if you’re selling

00:31:25.799 –> 00:31:29.542
something, you go talk to your
sales and marketing team, especially

00:31:29.560 –> 00:31:34.200
if you’re thinking about it in a
consumer market. If you’re looking at

00:31:34.200 –> 00:31:39.255
the journey of a consumer, where
they drop out in that journey really

00:31:39.280 –> 00:31:42.880
matters, and if you get somebody
right up to the end of that consumer

00:31:42.900 –> 00:31:47.895
journey, and they’re almost about to buy
your product or walk into your store,

00:31:47.920 –> 00:31:51.800
but they don’t, that is a
that is somebody you want to

00:31:51.799 –> 00:31:55.095
hyperfocus on, right? Because you want
to understand why they’re dropping out.

00:31:55.120 –> 00:31:59.099
And you would run that right back
and you’d adapt and change every

00:31:59.099 –> 00:32:01.465
part of that process
to optimise it, to make

00:32:01.489 –> 00:32:03.855
sure that we carry that
person right through.

00:32:03.880 –> 00:32:07.062
We don’t do that as well with —

00:32:07.080 –> 00:32:09.207
We don’t really
do it at all with

00:32:09.231 –> 00:32:13.015
candidates with employees,
yet candidates and employees

00:32:13.040 –> 00:32:15.236
can also be consumers
as well. Therefore,

00:32:15.260 –> 00:32:17.400
they can be very
important in terms of

00:32:17.400 –> 00:32:22.364
the organisation that we work
in. So I asked organisations to

00:32:22.388 –> 00:32:28.099
consider this. And it’s not a simple
process. And that may initially

00:32:28.099 –> 00:32:32.815
make you think the hints and tips
Theo’s giving me means it’s a lot of work.

00:32:32.840 –> 00:32:34.945
But actually, I think that
work’s really important.

00:32:34.960 –> 00:32:40.495
And if you were to segment all of
your process, if we think about your

00:32:40.520 –> 00:32:44.400
employee life cycle and you were
to break it down and segment it and

00:32:44.400 –> 00:32:47.422
to think, OK, what parts of it
do we think we might be failing

00:32:47.440 –> 00:32:51.920
individuals most from a neuroinclusive
perspective? And if we started

00:32:51.900 –> 00:32:55.338
to look at those and audit those
systems and processes, then we’re

00:32:55.362 –> 00:32:58.448
going to be able to understand
the way those barriers are.

00:32:58.480 –> 00:33:02.407
And that may well be through including
your current workforce. It may

00:33:02.432 –> 00:33:07.200
be through using external suppliers
or technologies or systems to be

00:33:07.225 –> 00:33:12.575
able to understand or to plug those
gaps. But until we start to do that,

00:33:12.600 –> 00:33:16.800
we’re going to miss out
significantly. And my suggestion is to

00:33:16.900 –> 00:33:21.321
audit and assess those systems and
processes. And you can do them one

00:33:21.345 –> 00:33:24.095
by one or you can
do it is a complete

00:33:24.120 –> 00:33:26.960
overhaul of all the
systems and processes.

00:33:27.000 –> 00:33:31.375
However, before you start that,
you need to increase awareness

00:33:31.400 –> 00:33:34.255
within your organisation. You
need to help your workforce

00:33:34.280 –> 00:33:38.856
understand what neurodiversity
is, what neuroinclusion is, why it

00:33:38.880 –> 00:33:43.900
matters, and why you’re going to
start on this journey of looking at

00:33:43.900 –> 00:33:47.450
where the challenges are within
the organisation before you

00:33:47.475 –> 00:33:53.080
take the steps to rectify them.
Because, at some point, you’re going to

00:33:53.099 –> 00:34:00.335
want to interview, assess, and
communicate with that workforce

00:34:00.360 –> 00:34:04.000
to understand how it is impacting
them. And some of that will be

00:34:04.000 –> 00:34:06.670
anonymous through surveys, and
some of that will be directly through

00:34:06.680 –> 00:34:09.483
sitting down and having
one-to-one conversations.

00:34:09.508 –> 00:34:12.655
Now we’ve done this
with an organisation.

00:34:12.680 –> 00:34:15.440
We’ve worked with
them for quite some time.

00:34:15.480 –> 00:34:18.001
But specifically
around neurodiversity,

00:34:18.025 –> 00:34:20.480
around a year ago,
we worked through

00:34:20.500 –> 00:34:24.138
this process with them. First
of all, we talked to the board and

00:34:24.162 –> 00:34:28.415
senior leadership team and advised them
on neurodiversity and neuroinclusion.

00:34:28.440 –> 00:34:31.347
So we got them bought in at
the top of your organisation.

00:34:31.372 –> 00:34:37.455
Now, Clariane — one of the largest health
and wellbeing organisations in Europe.

00:34:37.480 –> 00:34:42.215
We worked directly with their
UK arm, Berkley, and through

00:34:42.240 –> 00:34:46.400
working with the senior leadership
team at Clariane level, then at

00:34:46.400 –> 00:34:49.962
UK level, then working with their
management team to help them

00:34:49.986 –> 00:34:53.900
understand what neurodiversity
is, what neuroinclusion is,

00:34:53.900 –> 00:34:57.888
what we mean by it, and how it
potentially impacts their workforce.

00:34:57.912 –> 00:35:01.900
Then, talking to the rest of the
workforce so that they understand

00:35:01.900 –> 00:35:07.620
some of the terminology. And
we then surveyed the workforce

00:35:07.644 –> 00:35:14.055
alongside doing the assessment of
these different systems and processes.

00:35:14.080 –> 00:35:17.139
So that, ultimately, at the end
of it, we could feed back to them,

00:35:17.160 –> 00:35:21.400
to let them know where
the barriers were and if they

00:35:21.400 –> 00:35:23.810
can remove them. And by the
way, you can do this yourself.

00:35:23.835 –> 00:35:26.211
You don’t necessarily need to
work with an external provider.

00:35:26.236 –> 00:35:29.701
You might have somebody who’s skilled in
auditing and assessment. You might want to

00:35:29.720 –> 00:35:34.402
work with different providers at
different areas of that process.

00:35:34.427 –> 00:35:37.929
But you need to understand where the
gaps are, because until you do, you’re

00:35:37.960 –> 00:35:40.233
not able to plug the gaps;
you’re not able to rectify them.

00:35:40.371 –> 00:35:45.855
And so much insight came out from
surveying the workforce anonymously.

00:35:45.880 –> 00:35:50.000
One of the questions we asked them
was do they identify — after all the

00:35:50.000 –> 00:35:56.175
sessions we did with them — do they
identify as being from a neurominority?

00:35:56.200 –> 00:35:58.904
Ie, we’ve gone through
sessions with them.

00:35:58.929 –> 00:36:01.735
But ie, “Do you
identify as being ADHD?

00:36:01.760 –> 00:36:04.640
Dyslexic? Dyscalculic? And
do you have a diagnosis?”

00:36:04.660 –> 00:36:09.255
One in ten of they work force
came back and said, “Yes, we do.”

00:36:09.280 –> 00:36:13.255
Now, what’s important
with that is we don’t know for

00:36:13.280 –> 00:36:16.680
100% they accurately do. We’re
not we’re not asking for them to

00:36:16.900 –> 00:36:21.055
verify it with a document. What
we’re now seeing is 1 in 10 people

00:36:21.080 –> 00:36:24.480
are saying within the organisation
that, “Yes, we identify with it and

00:36:24.500 –> 00:36:29.190
we’re facing barriers.” We then went
on to ask them if they don’t have

00:36:29.200 –> 00:36:34.080
a diagnosis, do they identify with
being from a neurominority and

00:36:34.099 –> 00:36:36.794
facing barriers because it’s
in your neurological makeup?

00:36:36.819 –> 00:36:39.465
We got up to 3 in 10.
Two in ten more said,

00:36:39.489 –> 00:36:42.135
“Yes.” That was 3 in
10 of their workforce.

00:36:42.160 –> 00:36:44.821
We then asked if they have a
family member who they’re

00:36:44.840 –> 00:36:48.184
responsible for who they believed to
be from a neurominority,

00:36:48.209 –> 00:36:51.455
and we got up to —
it was almost 50% of

00:36:51.480 –> 00:36:53.120
the workforce. Now,
you can understand

00:36:53.143 –> 00:36:57.800
the impact that that now has. That
insight and information, along with loads

00:36:57.800 –> 00:37:02.958
of other insights that we
extracted, would able then to allow

00:37:03.000 –> 00:37:08.815
the organisation to take action and
to start working groups and to start

00:37:08.840 –> 00:37:12.258
further training and development with
managers, with the understanding

00:37:12.282 –> 00:37:15.699
that this was important to the
organisation, and the employees were

00:37:15.699 –> 00:37:19.181
saying, “We are facing barriers,
and these are the types of

00:37:19.205 –> 00:37:23.300
barriers that we’re facing.” At no
point would individuals having to

00:37:23.300 –> 00:37:28.438
come forwards and say, “I am dyslexic
and help me for this reason.”

00:37:28.462 –> 00:37:33.599
This was around understanding where
the problems were, how it was impacting

00:37:33.599 –> 00:37:37.571
the workforce, and then thinking
about a longer-term strategy around

00:37:37.596 –> 00:37:41.907
how we were going to
be able to deal with them.

00:37:42.467 –> 00:37:47.695
And what you then
find is — my co-author,

00:37:47.720 –> 00:37:49.840
Professor Amanda
Kirby, has created

00:37:49.875 –> 00:37:54.475
some incredible technology and
consultancy and advisory around then being

00:37:54.500 –> 00:37:59.538
able to help individuals understand
their individual neurological

00:37:59.562 –> 00:38:04.376
makeup and how they can be
supported. So, on the one hand,

00:38:04.401 –> 00:38:08.569
you need to be understanding your
systems, your processes, the barriers,

00:38:08.600 –> 00:38:14.320
the potential negative impact
lifting the lid off Pandora’s box,

00:38:14.599 –> 00:38:19.087
but also, then, being able to support
individuals that if they’re not

00:38:19.111 –> 00:38:23.599
privileged enough to be able to
gain the access to support through a

00:38:23.599 –> 00:38:27.837
diagnosis or may not want to go through
that process because it’s too long,

00:38:27.861 –> 00:38:32.099
you’re helping them understand
their neurological makeup and where

00:38:32.099 –> 00:38:36.252
some of the challenges and opportunities
may come from. And the real

00:38:36.280 –> 00:38:41.520
issue here is that a lot of people
may be misinformed, misadvised,

00:38:41.500 –> 00:38:45.302
misunderstood their neurological
makeup and therefore, they may really

00:38:45.327 –> 00:38:51.000
be able — they may be struggling in
communicating to the organisation of

00:38:51.000 –> 00:38:55.255
what they’re having problems with,
of why they’re not able to finish

00:38:55.280 –> 00:38:58.775
certain tasks, of why they’re
struggling to communicate with certain

00:38:58.800 –> 00:39:04.888
people, of why they keep on
getting into hot water over certain

00:39:04.912 –> 00:39:11.000
pieces of work, conversations,
etc. So I utilised to Do-IT Profiler

00:39:11.000 –> 00:39:16.146
by Amanda Kirby, not just for
myself when I started to explore my

00:39:16.170 –> 00:39:21.800
neurological makeup about 6/7 years
ago, when I realised — dyslexia,

00:39:22.000 –> 00:39:24.716
that I was diagnosed
with as a mature student,

00:39:24.740 –> 00:39:27.455
with no formal
qualifications in university —

00:39:27.480 –> 00:39:29.764
I was diagnosed
there with dyslexia.

00:39:29.800 –> 00:39:33.615
It was many, many years later that
I was thinking there’s something

00:39:33.640 –> 00:39:34.905
else going on in
my brain. And there’s

00:39:34.929 –> 00:39:36.400
other barriers
and opportunities I’m

00:39:36.400 –> 00:39:40.135
just not understanding — I utilised
the Do-IT Profiler to help me to

00:39:40.160 –> 00:39:43.055
be able to better understand that
neurological makeup, and it was powerful.

00:39:43.080 –> 00:39:47.804
I then utilised it to advocate
for my child because the school

00:39:47.840 –> 00:39:53.000
were not that forthcoming
because she’s highly introverted

00:39:53.000 –> 00:39:57.220
and quite quiet and compliant
and therefore, wasn’t a problem.

00:39:57.240 –> 00:40:00.415
Yet, she wasn’t
obtaining the information

00:40:00.440 –> 00:40:02.640
and she wasn’t learning
in that environment.

00:40:02.680 –> 00:40:04.997
And, for me, if you’re not learning
in the environment, that’s the greater

00:40:05.022 –> 00:40:08.200
problem, not whether you’re
compliant or not. And therefore I

00:40:08.199 –> 00:40:11.988
was able to utilise it to help me
advocate for my child because the

00:40:12.012 –> 00:40:15.800
the child version enabled us to have
that. Now, by the way, I’m sharing

00:40:15.800 –> 00:40:18.433
some tools and concepts
and ways of working —

00:40:18.457 –> 00:40:20.775
You can do these
things yourself.

00:40:20.800 –> 00:40:24.320
You can start very small.
You can support employees

00:40:24.300 –> 00:40:27.358
through simple mechanisms to better
understand some of the barriers

00:40:27.382 –> 00:40:30.300
and challenges. But there
needs to be trust that’s built there,

00:40:30.600 –> 00:40:35.472
initially, based on what we were
talking about around individuals are

00:40:35.480 –> 00:40:41.243
not comfortable at necessarily coming
forward with specific labels.

00:40:41.347 –> 00:40:48.375
So as I bring this to a close,
I’m hoping to ignite — I can see

00:40:48.400 –> 00:40:51.200
the conversations lighting up.
People are talking about diagnosis,

00:40:51.199 –> 00:40:56.300
the barriers, the challenges with
getting support. And it is horrendous

00:40:56.325 –> 00:41:03.074
out there, from the support
from the government, from local

00:41:03.099 –> 00:41:07.238
authorities. The money is not
there. We’re at a Tipping Point.

00:41:07.262 –> 00:41:10.615
I really, truly, believe that,
specifically within the UK.

00:41:10.640 –> 00:41:15.335
And something needs to change
significantly, but I do believe we have

00:41:15.360 –> 00:41:18.880
the power in this room today to
make a positive impact within the

00:41:18.900 –> 00:41:21.732
workplace, which is what we’re
talking about here, what I’m trying to

00:41:21.757 –> 00:41:25.662
excite and delight people
around the topic here.

00:41:25.687 –> 00:41:28.311
So there’s something
I want to leave

00:41:28.335 –> 00:41:31.335
you with before we
jump into questions,

00:41:31.360 –> 00:41:34.455
that you may have
and that’s we see

00:41:34.480 –> 00:41:35.708
the world in a different way.

00:41:35.720 –> 00:41:37.713
Whatever label we want
to put on it, whatever

00:41:37.737 –> 00:41:40.095
understanding of co-occurrence
and everything else,

00:41:40.120 –> 00:41:42.775
we all have a way of
visualising the world, and

00:41:42.800 –> 00:41:49.495
whether that’s like High Contrast, who has
synesthesia, and he sees sound as colour,

00:41:49.520 –> 00:41:52.680
and that literally influences
all part of his music.

00:41:52.732 –> 00:41:58.815
One of the most renowned drum
and bass music producers — electronic

00:41:58.840 –> 00:42:01.920
music producers in the world,
as far as I’m concerned, and it’s

00:42:01.900 –> 00:42:07.562
because of the way that he
perceives the world through seeing

00:42:07.586 –> 00:42:14.099
sound as colour that makes him
incredible in what he does. Glen Keane,

00:42:14.800 –> 00:42:16.853
who has aphantasia
or is impacted by

00:42:16.877 –> 00:42:19.520
aphantasia, however
you want to define it —

00:42:19.560 –> 00:42:22.400
he cannot visualise the
world through his mind’s eye.

00:42:22.400 –> 00:42:26.115
He doesn’t see things when he goes
to sleep in the same way that some

00:42:26.139 –> 00:42:30.775
other people might. Yet he’s one of the
most incredible cartoonists for Disney.

00:42:30.800 –> 00:42:36.055
And Maggie Aderin-Pocock,
who’s dyslexic, and when we think of

00:42:36.080 –> 00:42:39.800
the incredible way that she
perceives and sees the world,

00:42:39.800 –> 00:42:45.615
it is more common the individuals
who are dyslexic see in 3D, have

00:42:45.640 –> 00:42:49.600
incredible spatial awareness.
So if we taking the dyslexia, the

00:42:49.600 –> 00:42:53.687
aphantasia, the synesthesia, the fact
that a lot of us will just see in 2D —

00:42:53.960 –> 00:42:57.800
We are visualising the world,
we are experiencing the world in

00:42:57.800 –> 00:43:03.055
such a different way. And I see what
synesthesia — synesthesia for High Contrast —

00:43:03.080 –> 00:43:05.800
— it’s different for different
people — but it’s almost like

00:43:05.800 –> 00:43:11.015
one experience — the experience
of hearing sound — is impacted by

00:43:11.040 –> 00:43:17.295
another experience that others wouldn’t. So
in the instance for High Contrast, it’s colour.

00:43:17.320 –> 00:43:21.495
So when he hears certain
sounds, he has a significant colour

00:43:21.520 –> 00:43:25.455
come to his mind’s eye, and it’s
most prominent when he knows

00:43:25.480 –> 00:43:29.727
he’s creating the right types
of sounds. He also gets an

00:43:29.751 –> 00:43:34.880
experience of machines, so the
feeling of industrial machines and the

00:43:34.900 –> 00:43:39.171
beats are like machines and
therefore, that experience of beat has

00:43:39.195 –> 00:43:43.800
a significant impact on the way that
he creates and feels about music.

00:43:43.950 –> 00:43:47.647
This can also be seen not just
in music, but in artists and in other

00:43:47.671 –> 00:43:51.199
areas of the world in creative
elements of the way that people

00:43:51.199 –> 00:43:55.795
experience one thing, but they have
another, powerful experience that

00:43:55.800 –> 00:44:01.207
can come and interplay at the same
time. But this is the point, right?

00:44:01.240 –> 00:44:06.295
It is this incredible, diverse
way of a seeing the world and the

00:44:06.320 –> 00:44:09.520
Mexican tetra blind cave fish will
experience it in another completely

00:44:09.500 –> 00:44:13.338
different way. And by nature of
the way that we have evolved and

00:44:13.362 –> 00:44:17.815
adapted to exist in this incredible
planet. But I come back to the point.

00:44:17.840 –> 00:44:21.432
We have created the barriers.
We have created the challenges.

00:44:21.457 –> 00:44:26.400
We have created the bright
light. We are still creating barriers

00:44:26.400 –> 00:44:30.895
within our organisation. We
created systems like Horizon that

00:44:30.920 –> 00:44:35.280
meant that people went to prison
and, unfortunately, faced significant

00:44:35.300 –> 00:44:40.338
injustice in their lives. These are
things we humans created and instilled

00:44:40.362 –> 00:44:44.544
upon other people and told
them it was for their own good.

00:44:44.569 –> 00:44:50.255
We have the power to remove them
to change them to adapt them, right?

00:44:50.280 –> 00:44:53.948
But we need to take responsibility
for that and we need to go back into

00:44:53.960 –> 00:44:58.330
our environment and really take
some time, and to consideration to

00:44:58.355 –> 00:45:04.599
assess where those barriers are,
where those gaps are, and to work with

00:45:04.599 –> 00:45:08.136
others to be able to plug those
gaps and empower more people to

00:45:08.161 –> 00:45:13.975
thrive at work to succeed rather than
to struggle, which so many of us have.

00:45:14.000 –> 00:45:19.720
So thank you very much. I’m going to
stop sharing my screen and we can

00:45:19.762 –> 00:45:25.228
perhaps go into some questions.
Thanks for staying with me.

00:45:25.240 –> 00:45:30.255
Amazing. Thank you so much, Theo.
I don’t know if you would have been

00:45:30.280 –> 00:45:34.600
able to see but there was
great conversations going on in

00:45:34.599 –> 00:45:40.137
the chat whilst you were talking —
and just encouraging people to pop

00:45:40.161 –> 00:45:45.699
any questions you might have for
Theo and or myself in the Q&A section.

00:45:45.960 –> 00:45:50.946
We’ve got quite a few coming
through. And also, remember you can

00:45:50.970 –> 00:45:55.800
upvote as well. So, please
please, please upvote any that

00:45:55.800 –> 00:45:57.505
you particularly
want answers to.

00:45:57.529 –> 00:45:59.187
So I’ll read out a
couple of questions if

00:45:59.212 –> 00:46:02.130
that’s OK, Theo? And
then, if you’re happy to

00:46:02.160 –> 00:46:06.231
answer them. So Lucy’s asked,
“I’ve a question, please, about

00:46:06.255 –> 00:46:10.199
employees paying for neurodiversity
diagnostic assessments as

00:46:10.199 –> 00:46:14.637
many employees are asking for this.
In my view, this is not very —

00:46:14.661 –> 00:46:19.099
not a very social model approach,
not required for access to work, and

00:46:19.099 –> 00:46:24.653
also problematic for GPs, as they do not
accept privately assessed diagnoses —

00:46:24.920 –> 00:46:28.026
do not always accept
privately assessed diagnoses.

00:46:28.040 –> 00:46:31.357
It will be great to hear your view
on this.” So yeah. Do you have a

00:46:31.381 –> 00:46:35.000
view on — I guess there was
a lot of chatter around difficulties

00:46:35.000 –> 00:46:39.211
getting diagnostic —
diagnoses through the NHS.

00:46:39.240 –> 00:46:44.005
Obviously, there’s the private, but
that comes at a cost and then there’s a —

00:46:44.099 –> 00:46:47.862
sometimes a need in the
workplace for a diagnosis.

00:46:47.886 –> 00:46:52.199
Yeah, absolutely. So some organisations
will support it. I’ve worked with many

00:46:52.199 –> 00:46:56.850
organisations. Some see the
value in the needs. They may work

00:46:56.874 –> 00:47:02.000
with mental health and wellbeing
charities or or not-for-profit

00:47:02.000 –> 00:47:08.375
organisations. They may provide
support from a psychological

00:47:08.400 –> 00:47:12.480
perspective and therefore, at a
tipping point — that this is the key

00:47:12.500 –> 00:47:17.185
thing, right? A Tipping Point of
where they feel, “Hmm. Maybe this may

00:47:17.210 –> 00:47:23.199
become a legal risk,” they then
may pay for private diagnosis.

00:47:23.500 –> 00:47:28.295
The problem I have here is
that we don’t account — we still

00:47:28.320 –> 00:47:32.240
don’t account, in many instances,
for the level of co-occurrence,

00:47:32.280 –> 00:47:36.085
and we’re still focused on a
model the requires you to look into

00:47:36.110 –> 00:47:42.175
your past as a child, to be able to
identify whether or not you are autistic.

00:47:42.200 –> 00:47:45.700
You know, what were you like when you
were a child? What were you like —

00:47:45.725 –> 00:47:50.505
that leaves so much
confusion, potentially, and also

00:47:50.520 –> 00:47:55.588
a lot of us may not be able to
communicate that effectively,

00:47:55.612 –> 00:48:00.680
and therefore, we may miss out on the
support because we’re not able to

00:48:00.699 –> 00:48:04.687
access the label. So this brings
complexity for organisations

00:48:04.711 –> 00:48:09.300
because do they start just paying
£1000, £2000, £3000 per dual

00:48:09.300 –> 00:48:13.238
assessment, triple assessment or
whatever? And then because of the

00:48:13.262 –> 00:48:17.655
co-occurrence, you may not actually
come out as any but, in fact, you are,

00:48:17.680 –> 00:48:20.961
it’s just the model for
assessment is built poorly because

00:48:20.986 –> 00:48:27.400
you’re a woman and you’re black
and you speak English as a

00:48:27.400 –> 00:48:31.338
second language and and and and
and — and therefore, that diagnostic

00:48:31.362 –> 00:48:35.300
model did not suit your needs. We’re
then creating an additional layer

00:48:35.300 –> 00:48:39.570
of bias and barrier to certain people.
So if you’re white, you’re male

00:48:39.594 –> 00:48:43.377
your organisation pays for the
assessment, you get it, you pass —

00:48:43.402 –> 00:48:47.539
if you’re someone else, you may not.
See, I think it’s more complex than

00:48:47.563 –> 00:48:51.984
just “Should organisations pay for it
or shouldn’t?” We should have a better

00:48:52.099 –> 00:48:57.455
system where it’s intervention
from the government, right?

00:48:57.480 –> 00:49:02.735
We pay taxes. This shouldn’t be all in
on organisations from my perspective.

00:49:02.760 –> 00:49:05.560
It should be government intervention.
It should be support directly

00:49:05.591 –> 00:49:09.895
from the government. It should be
coming into to reduce waiting times.

00:49:09.920 –> 00:49:14.126
Also if we think about a
five-year period to get a diagnosis,

00:49:14.151 –> 00:49:17.494
where’s the help in the
five years? It’s not there.

00:49:17.519 –> 00:49:21.361
When we think about our child, it’s —
you’re on a waiting list, five years later

00:49:21.400 –> 00:49:25.436
you get that diagnosis. Oh then, by the
way, it doesn’t really mean anything.

00:49:25.461 –> 00:49:27.832
You still don’t have the knowledge
and expertise. You still have to

00:49:27.857 –> 00:49:31.000
go out and learn it all yourself.
You have to join communities and talk

00:49:31.000 –> 00:49:34.026
to other parents. That’s where
the power is. I’ve talked to other

00:49:34.051 –> 00:49:38.900
people in Slack communities or in
Discord communities about ADHD and

00:49:38.900 –> 00:49:42.982
be misinformed and be led by somebody
who’s not that genuine.

00:49:44.240 –> 00:49:50.480
You can see where companies are like,
“Whoa, don’t even want to go there or

00:49:50.500 –> 00:49:54.598
get involved.” What I think we
need is greater mechanisms for

00:49:54.622 –> 00:50:00.332
supporting individuals earlier
on. And that’s why I talk about

00:50:00.600 –> 00:50:05.775
not just identification of a
label because if you’ve not got

00:50:05.800 –> 00:50:08.313
it early on, it may be more
difficult to get it.

00:50:08.338 –> 00:50:12.558
But it’s the identification of where are
the barriers? Where’s the impact on mental

00:50:12.583 –> 00:50:18.300
health and wellbeing? Where’s the
potential points that will mean that

00:50:18.300 –> 00:50:23.300
you may end up without a job,
without a house, without support?

00:50:23.320 –> 00:50:29.520
And then you fall into a different area
of support, when we could have

00:50:29.500 –> 00:50:32.344
helped so much more people before
that. So I’m much more interested

00:50:32.360 –> 00:50:35.800
in the mechanisms we can put in place
that are much easier, simpler —

00:50:36.000 –> 00:50:39.888
just to allow individuals that,
yes, they would like a diagnosis of

00:50:39.912 –> 00:50:43.800
ADHD or autism, for example, because
they believe that they are and

00:50:43.800 –> 00:50:47.646
they deserve to have that diagnosis
in the wide support. But today,

00:50:47.670 –> 00:50:51.400
really, they just want to be able
to have better conversations with

00:50:51.400 –> 00:50:56.068
their manager, and are really
struggling. And it is linked with the

00:50:56.092 –> 00:51:01.199
way that they see the world, the way
they communicate, the way that the

00:51:01.199 –> 00:51:04.788
environment is impacting them and
making them feel. And I think that

00:51:04.812 –> 00:51:08.400
is something that we can change
tomorrow, but we can really start to

00:51:08.400 –> 00:51:13.375
think about that through the
auditing, looking at the systems and

00:51:13.400 –> 00:51:16.600
processes and making those adaptations
and changes. But we need to

00:51:16.599 –> 00:51:18.633
include the community in those
conversations, to make sure that we

00:51:18.658 –> 00:51:22.199
make the relevant ones within our
organisations and environments and

00:51:22.199 –> 00:51:25.739
communities and education settings
and what have you. Sorry, long answer,

00:51:25.760 –> 00:51:28.800
but this, it’s complex. That’s
the challenge that we’re facing.

00:51:28.984 –> 00:51:30.507
We need to simplify it.

00:51:30.520 –> 00:51:33.855
That leads really
nicely on to the next

00:51:33.880 –> 00:51:38.600
question, and actually, I’ll kind of
link to two together. So…

00:51:38.599 –> 00:51:42.702
Do you have any practical tips for line
managers to help create environments

00:51:42.726 –> 00:51:46.500
in which people feel more comfortable
disclosing at work? And then if —

00:51:46.500 –> 00:51:49.864
what would be a nice one is, “Is
there any — further down — is there

00:51:49.889 –> 00:51:55.699
any examples of any companies
that you worked from that

00:51:55.699 –> 00:52:01.255
provide examples of creating that kind of
neuroinclusive work and it being the norm?

00:52:02.440 –> 00:52:05.200
So let me tell you, if
you’ve not watched Sex

00:52:05.199 –> 00:52:08.937
Education, go and watch that as a
programme. Fascinating, right? Because

00:52:08.961 –> 00:52:12.855
I’m thinking around the generational
shift as well. And the reason

00:52:12.880 –> 00:52:16.280
why I mention that is because
some of the topics that come out and

00:52:16.312 –> 00:52:20.375
identify with the one of the main
characters, who’s the mum, who has a child

00:52:20.400 –> 00:52:23.300
She’s talking, as a sex therapist,
and he’s going through some

00:52:23.325 –> 00:52:28.400
experiences. I kind of feel that
almost as a dad to an ND child, as an

00:52:28.400 –> 00:52:31.538
ND dad, but who’s speaking
about this topic, right? Yet, I’m

00:52:31.560 –> 00:52:35.600
“vulnerable” in some respects as well
because I’m a human being like all of us.

00:52:36.200 –> 00:52:43.175
So when I consider that
journey and I think about having a

00:52:43.200 –> 00:52:47.400
conversation with somebody, a
meaningful conversation, often if you

00:52:47.400 –> 00:52:50.938
put all the weight and responsibility
on the individual they’re going

00:52:50.962 –> 00:52:54.500
to stop talking to you. So Sex
Education has a great example of where

00:52:54.520 –> 00:52:58.800
the mum is almost like. “Oh, she
told me. I didn’t know what to do

00:52:58.816 –> 00:53:03.300
with it. And then she stopped talking
to me.” And the advice there is

00:53:03.300 –> 00:53:07.399
to well, go back and learn something
— can take something to the table

00:53:07.423 –> 00:53:09.867
and share to show
you’ve thought about it.

00:53:09.891 –> 00:53:12.695
There’s no difference
with the manager, right?

00:53:12.720 –> 00:53:16.399
Where I’ve seen this work
within organisations, I love talking

00:53:16.423 –> 00:53:20.575
to Leena and Sean at BBC many years
ago — included them in the book.

00:53:20.600 –> 00:53:24.855
They basically — Leena went
to Sean and went, “This is who I am.

00:53:24.880 –> 00:53:28.000
This is what I’m about.” So she did
more right she came forward and he

00:53:28.000 –> 00:53:30.362
then went, “Right. I’m going to go
away and learn. I’m going to go and

00:53:30.386 –> 00:53:33.099
educate myself. And now I’m going
to bring that back to the table and

00:53:33.099 –> 00:53:35.716
say, ‘What do you think about
that? How do you feel about that?'”

00:53:36.861 –> 00:53:40.599
Rather than going, “Oh, you tell you’re
me autistic. So let me tell you about

00:53:40.599 –> 00:53:44.375
all the things I might be able to do
for you” — because you don’t really

00:53:44.400 –> 00:53:46.320
understand them. You don’t understand
the complexity of their life,

00:53:46.300 –> 00:53:49.915
what’s going on, their journey —
all of that you just immediately go

00:53:49.939 –> 00:53:53.655
solution building, which is
problematic. What you need to do as a

00:53:53.680 –> 00:53:57.168
manager is you need to be able
to go away and educate yourself a bit

00:53:57.192 –> 00:54:00.680
and then go like you would with
any conversation, “Hey, I listened to

00:54:00.699 –> 00:54:04.012
this podcast. This person was
sharing this stuff about this.

00:54:04.040 –> 00:54:07.800
What do you think about that?” Bumph —
opened up the dialogue, opened up the

00:54:07.800 –> 00:54:10.988
conversation. No pressure on
that individual to say that they need

00:54:11.012 –> 00:54:14.199
to share about themselves. But
you open up a conversation about

00:54:14.199 –> 00:54:18.066
something, and that starts to enable
you to develop that conversation

00:54:18.080 –> 00:54:22.600
further. Start small and build. Don’t
go on with the most, you know,

00:54:23.699 –> 00:54:31.295
dramatic problematic idea or
concept first of all. Just start with,

00:54:31.320 –> 00:54:35.311
“I watched this programme. And this
is how they portrayed this thing.

00:54:35.320 –> 00:54:39.103
I found it a bit odd or strange or I
was interested or fascinated. What

00:54:39.127 –> 00:54:42.800
do you think about that?” And I
think that’s a much more productive

00:54:42.800 –> 00:54:45.988
way to start having productive
conversation within the team

00:54:46.012 –> 00:54:49.199
as well, by the way. Start
as you mean to go on. Start

00:54:49.300 –> 00:54:53.007
building those conversations within
the team, build them individually

00:54:53.032 –> 00:54:58.099
and start to create that sense
of psychological safety, but, but

00:54:58.099 –> 00:55:01.488
protecting individuals because if
that person shares with the team

00:55:01.512 –> 00:55:05.838
that they’re autistic today, and you go and
to take another job as the leader tomorrow,

00:55:06.000 –> 00:55:08.680
where does that leave
that individual? Well, it leaves them

00:55:08.712 –> 00:55:12.500
with a different leader tomorrow.
And it may not be as a leader who’s

00:55:12.500 –> 00:55:16.338
as empathetic, as caring as
compassionate, as understanding, as

00:55:16.362 –> 00:55:20.199
appreciative as you were. So
we also have a responsibility and

00:55:20.199 –> 00:55:24.524
accountability as leaders, that just
because we think we’re good and

00:55:24.560 –> 00:55:30.000
we’re OK, and we’re doing the
best by them, doesn’t mean the next

00:55:30.000 –> 00:55:33.738
person will. So we have we have to
future-proof it as well. We have to

00:55:33.762 –> 00:55:37.500
think about the the longer-term
impact on that individual who’s been

00:55:37.500 –> 00:55:41.563
at the company for 15 years, and
we’ve only been there for 2, as

00:55:41.600 –> 00:55:45.920
a leader. So I think it’s not as
simple as, “Individual tell me your

00:55:45.900 –> 00:55:49.055
problems,” it’s what am I going
to do as a leader to protect that

00:55:49.080 –> 00:55:56.400
individual and to ensure that
they’re not left in a desperate

00:55:56.400 –> 00:55:59.065
situation in the future, which,
unfortunately, I think many are.

00:55:59.090 –> 00:56:01.865
That’s the problem we have.

00:56:01.880 –> 00:56:04.680
Thank you very much,
Theo, for answering that

00:56:04.699 –> 00:56:09.215
question. Yeah I couldn’t
agree with more with that, I think.

00:56:09.240 –> 00:56:12.480
Yeah, I mean, we —
line managing people, running a

00:56:12.500 –> 00:56:17.735
business as well, and especially
in this sort of assistive technology

00:56:17.760 –> 00:56:21.400
space — I think one of the other
things I’ve kind of learned is kind

00:56:21.426 –> 00:56:29.255
of leading, I guess, by example.
And not related to this, but it is —

00:56:29.280 –> 00:56:33.280
is that there’s a book called Radical
Candor, which somebody in our

00:56:33.300 –> 00:56:39.895
business advocated for and I
read. And one of the things that that

00:56:39.920 –> 00:56:45.000
advocates for is that, as a
leader, it’s useful to

00:56:45.000 –> 00:56:49.215
understand yourself and then
voice that back to people that you

00:56:49.240 –> 00:56:52.400
manage. So, for instance, for me,
I’m dyslexic. I have ADHD; I struggle

00:56:52.400 –> 00:56:54.788
with lots of different things.
I have quite bad anxiety.

00:56:54.813 –> 00:56:57.800
It’s saying, “Look, I’m going to be good
at these things. I might really struggle

00:56:57.800 –> 00:57:00.624
with that when you bring this
up, and this is kind of why. And I’m

00:57:00.649 –> 00:57:04.400
not that good at that,” and if you
can — if you’re setting the example

00:57:04.400 –> 00:57:08.138
that you can say these things to
people you manage and you can

00:57:08.162 –> 00:57:11.900
lead by example that you’re open
and transparent about the things you

00:57:11.900 –> 00:57:15.438
struggle with and how you want
the business to support you, even

00:57:15.462 –> 00:57:19.000
though you might be the leader then,
that does, I find, or have found

00:57:19.000 –> 00:57:21.830
that that has opened up
conversations the other way as well.

00:57:21.840 –> 00:57:26.320
Just very briefly. That’s incredible, Rich.
And it’s right. And I interviewed a

00:57:26.300 –> 00:57:30.338
manager and an employee, and
it’s on the podcast if you want

00:57:30.362 –> 00:57:34.400
to hear it, but they worked in
forestry. She was having significant

00:57:34.400 –> 00:57:37.588
challenges. In the end, she
was identified as potentially being

00:57:37.612 –> 00:57:40.800
autistic, and she got a diagnosis
and support. It transformed her

00:57:40.800 –> 00:57:45.351
experience. But what he said,
which was fascinating, was that,

00:57:45.375 –> 00:57:50.599
“I started, then, explaining to her she
needs to take time out. She needs to

00:57:50.599 –> 00:57:54.387
lie down on the floor when she
needs to she can cry. She — whatever

00:57:54.400 –> 00:57:58.600
it is” — all things that she needed
to do that she said herself

00:57:58.800 –> 00:58:01.863
that helped her in certain
instances. But then he was

00:58:01.887 –> 00:58:05.199
saying, “I realised I was telling her
all these things, and I wouldn’t doing

00:58:05.199 –> 00:58:10.538
any of them myself.” And he
said it, “Just — being, having a

00:58:10.562 –> 00:58:15.900
greater empathy and consideration
for her on her journey made me

00:58:15.900 –> 00:58:20.455
a better human being because,
actually, I wasn’t I wasn’t doing many

00:58:20.480 –> 00:58:23.600
of these things I was telling her
to.” And he didn’t necessarily need to

00:58:23.625 –> 00:58:28.095
lie down, but he did need to
think about the way that he saw the

00:58:28.120 –> 00:58:30.880
world and that he managed his life
and managed to other people and

00:58:30.900 –> 00:58:36.188
that he allowed others to manage him
and how he saw his workplace and just by

00:58:36.212 –> 00:58:41.500
turning the table, it educated
him on better mental health and

00:58:41.500 –> 00:58:45.469
wellbeing for him and is wider workforce.
I thought that was so powerful.

00:58:45.494 –> 00:58:50.000
Absolutely. Fantastic. And there
is quite a lot of questions left,

00:58:50.000 –> 00:58:53.888
which I, unfortunately, don’t think
we’ll get time to answer now, but

00:58:53.912 –> 00:58:57.800
we will get back to them and we
will send you responses afterwards.

00:58:57.800 –> 00:59:01.288
So even if you’ve got questions
popping up now, then still put them

00:59:01.312 –> 00:59:04.800
in the Q&A, and we’ll get
back. But I think it’s time for us

00:59:04.800 –> 00:59:09.638
to wrap up. So I want to finish by
just saying a massive thank you to

00:59:09.662 –> 00:59:14.500
Theo for joining us and providing
us that enlightening talk.

00:59:14.500 –> 00:59:18.790
That was really useful. And thank
you to everyone for participating

00:59:18.800 –> 00:59:23.480
and making these webinars so
enjoyable and such a dynamic

00:59:23.500 –> 00:59:27.288
event. So thanks so much for
that. Everyone’s going to get a

00:59:27.312 –> 00:59:31.099
CPD certificate. So, as you
leave, there is a survey

00:59:31.099 –> 00:59:34.973
that will pop up, If you can provide
us feedback, that’s really, really

00:59:34.997 –> 00:59:38.699
helpful. It helps us guide future
talks and events and make sure

00:59:38.699 –> 00:59:42.137
we’re covering topics and
bringing in speakers that you want to

00:59:42.161 –> 00:59:45.599
hear from. So please fill that
out. And then, after that, you’ll be

00:59:45.599 –> 00:59:49.887
sent to your CPD certificate for
the this event. As I say, the

00:59:49.911 –> 00:59:54.199
session was recorded. So we
will send that over to you, along

00:59:54.199 –> 00:59:58.935
with the transcript in the next
day. Next month’s webinars,

00:59:58.960 –> 01:00:02.400
please come along. As I mentioned,
there is one in February on reframing

01:00:02.400 –> 01:00:05.631
neurodiversity for better mental
health and one in March on

01:00:05.655 –> 01:00:09.500
demystifying access to work. Do
feed in by that survey to let us know

01:00:09.500 –> 01:00:13.372
what else you want to hear about
as we plan the the whole year aheads —

01:00:13.396 –> 01:00:17.699
webinar series. And that’s
fantastic. And yeah and come along to

01:00:17.699 –> 01:00:20.608
the Dyslexia Show. We’d love to
love to see you there. So we’ll ping

01:00:20.640 –> 01:00:25.280
you a link to join that as well.
And that is it. So, thanks again.

01:00:25.300 –> 01:00:29.538
Thank you, everybody, for joining
us. Thank you to Theo. Thank you for

01:00:29.562 –> 01:00:33.800
being so brilliant and joining in in the
conversations, and yeah. Hopefully, we’ll

01:00:33.800 –> 01:00:35.199
see you again soon.

01:00:37.800 –> 01:00:38.500
Thanks, everyone.